Aunt Margaret gave that tiger maple four poster which was made by slaves at Oaklyn Plantation to 
Willie, plus the spool bed; the present twin beds in East upstairs bedroom came from Marmee (Mary 
McIver James--Buvver's youngest sister)I don't know where that is now, but he grew up with it and 
it was at Cedar, too. Somebody has it; it was a three quarters bed; that bed was in his room for a 
long time; There were the twin beds; I don't know when they were taken out; Dan and Lucy have the 
twin beds; They came from Darlington and are not antiques…the spool bed...your mother probably 
knows where that is; that stayed with Willie.

...The Crosswell skin, daddy had, your daddy had, and Dan definitely had it; he had that place on 
his back; I just had a basal cell removed before we moved to Longwood; Frank has had two or three 
removed;

Cancer certainly runs in our family, doesn't it?

Oh yes! Four generations: Daddy's; mine (including Peggy, Willie and myself) and my first cousins, 
seven to be exact ; Mot had melanoma; and Stevie had leukemia;

Mot had? Yes, she had a place right on the bridge of her nose; I had wondered what had happened, 
but had never asked; We were talking about the sun one summer at Cedar Mountain, and she said, "I 
was really lucky"; and I had wondered; I was minding my own business and that is when she told me 
that she had had melanoma.

So here we are, the long awaited time...let's tell them where we are!

This is June 3, 1995. We are in apartment 338w Chambrell Retirement Home 180 Landover place in 
Longwood Florida; here we are so where do we go?

The whole purpose of this is to get a recording of the different generations of our family and to 
record your memories regarding the family. Where do you think is the best starting place?

The James and the Crosswells without exception escaped Europe because of religious persecution: on 
both sides we go back to the first settlers: the Mayflower Pilgrims; the English Puritans, the 
French Huguenots, the German Paltine settlers; Scotch Covenanters; Welsh and Ulster Presbyterians.

Buvver's side goes to New England through the Kendalls and that's the James side;
the Williamson side goes back to Virginia and that's the English side. On the Crosswell side my 
great grandfather Gower, who was born in Maine, came to Greenville, SC before the war between the 
States. And then on Buvver's side her grandmother Kendall was descended from New Englanders and she 
ended up in New Orleans and came to Darlington during the War between the states. They called 
themselves refugees, when they came to Darlington.  So, a brief summary of many, many generations. 
All of this is well documented. The Crofts will soon be publishing the book on the Crosswell-Gower 
side and on the James side, the records are very clear even in the history of lower South Carolina 
and in the history of the churches. You will find mention of the James, Witherspoons, Ervins. It is 
very easy to find out about our family, fortunately. (Picture 1)

So when we get to Darlington, Buvver's father was Robert Ervin James. (Picture 2)

 

Now there is a question as to whether he should be the second or the first. There was a Robert 
Ervin James who died during the War between the States who was actually the first Robert Ervin 
James, but through the years, way back, as I remember it, he , Papa, my grandfather, went by R.E., 
Sr. , and the one we call Uncle(Ed)," Jr". And Bob James the third. Now I think he goes by Junior, 
so I don't know how you want to look at it. But Papa married Meta Williamson. Her real name is 
Margaret Jane. Now I think THAT is a beautiful name. But Buvver said that along the way her father 
started calling her Meta, so she went by Meta, so that is Granny and Papa , your great grandmother 
and grandfather.

After their marriage, Granny and Papa lived in Darlington in a house just off Pearl Street near the 
Gulf station. Buvver was born here and later they all moved to 141 Oak St - Sis' home. It is now 
owned by Dr. John Wilson. At that time Uncle Bright, not yet married, his mother (also the mother 
of Granny, Sis, and Aunt Mamie Edwards) lived there-- she was Margaret Jane McIver Williamson, the 
2nd wife of Benjamin Franklin Williamson, Jr, the owner of Oaklyn. (Picture 3)

 

When Fairview was completed Papa and Granny left Sis's but Buvver stayed on-- this is where she 
grew up. She spent the weekends with her family and the week days with Sis, and, in effect, was 
Sis's child! Uncle-- Robert-- was born just after moving to Fairview, 2 years older than Buvver, 
then Martmee -- Margaret; Howdy-- Annie and Marree--Mary = five in all. (Picture 4)

Sis was granny's sister?

Yes. Sis was Anne Eliza, for whom I am named. Buvver mentioned in later years that Sis wanted to 
adopt her, and Uncle Bright put his foot down.

How far was Sis's from Fairview? About 3-4 miles. Any speculation why Buvver stayed at Sis's?

Well, since the time she was born she had lived there with these older adults and then Granny and 
Papa were building the house, moving and having Uncle, so that's the only reason I can give. But 
she did show me the house where she was born, and Granny and Papa were renting a place before they 
moved to Sis's, and I could show you where it is if it is still there in Darlington; it is in 
Darlington itself and not in Darlington county; all of the rest of them, to my knowledge were born 
at Fairview. And then on Papa's side there is all kinds of documentation about how some of them 
came from New Orleans and married into the James family; and the James family, with the 
Witherspoons, Ervin's, and another family came over from the north of Ireland; they were not Irish 
nor Welsh; none of them were Irish; they were scotch and came from Scotland; some were sent over by 
James VI of England, you can get your history about that. And they came over as a group to South 
Carolina and had been given a grant by the King of England and it is very interesting that they 
were never to be under the Church of England...EVER! They came over, they were Scotch Covenanters, 
Ulsters or Presbyterians. We are descendants of John Knox , a Scotsman, who is one of the great 
reformers and who was carried on his "wars" with the Queen of England. John Knox was the ancestor 
of John Witherspoon, the only minister to sign the Declaration of Independance. He was a professor 
at Princeton and was the Uncle of our John Witherspoon.

After the War between the States, the William Elias James built Palmetto Plantation, later called 
Palmetto Hall, which was said to be one of the finest houses in the area. This was Papa's family, 
and they had come from Kingstree to Indiantown to Darlington County; they were originally from 
Kingstree, and that means the King's Tree; that's where they ended up after landing in Charleston. 
And Buvver was living with Sis, and Daddy, GiGi, your grandfather, came to Darlington to work for 
Uncle Bright as an accountant. (Picture 5)

 

This was in what relation to his wartime experience? This was before. And Buvver would have been in 
high school. She would be out on the front porch with a date, and he would be close by and she went 
to the movies and he would go, too, and harass her. So he really got to know her. He was about 7.5 
years older than she.

When did the official courting period begin for them? Well, it must have gone on somewhere during 
that period. She went to Winthrop and that was like a prison; he would go to see her, and she said 
he could stand outside the fence and talk to her. {Bob James later reported that he would pose as 
her Uncle so that she would be able to receive her}

But he was writing letters to her at Winthrop? Yes, right. It must have developed from the time he 
was there to before she went to Winthrop. She would have been in high school. Did you know anything 
about how they dated or what they would do on dates? No, because they would never talked about it 
They talked mainly about how Daddy kidded Buvver when she was growing up. And really not much is 
said about it. I'm surprised really that they got married. They were married almost immediately 
after she graduated from Winthrop. Uncle Bright was a very well known philanthropist and sharp 
businessman known not only throughout that area but also throughout the state. (Letter 1)

 

Now Uncle Bright the one is who the park in Darlington is named for? Right, Bright Williamson.  And 
he owned all of that swampland down there where they have the Thanksgiving hunt. In fact, backing 
up, his father, Benjamin Franklin Williamson was a very successful farmer, and he left each one of 
his sons, that would be Uncle Ben, Uncle Bright and Uncle McIver, a plantation. And the one we come 
directly from is of course Oaklyn. And then then there is Mont Claire. And they were both very fine 
houses and of course, Gilmore.
And he left each one of the girls, money daughters, Granny, Sis and Aunt Mamie. So he was obviously 
well-to-do. So that takes care of them.

When we get to Daddy's family, it is all very well documented, and when the book comes out, 
everything is going to be in that. But something that has impressed me more and more, and Buvver 
used to say this over and over, Presbyterians believe in education.  And when you look at that you 
can see it. Every one of Daddy's brothers and sisters, if they didn't stay in college, they had the 
opportunity. They went to the Citadel, Davidson, and I think Daddy was the only one to go to the 
University of North Carolina; the girls went to Agnes Scott; and Grandmother Crosswell, Daddy's 
mother went to Mary Baldwin College. To me that's amazing for back in those times. And the same for 
the James side. They went to college. Papa went to the University of North Carolina; Granny went to 
a finishing school in Columbia; I don't know about her mother where she went. But Papa's father 
went to Oglethorpe College in Milledgeville, GA.  And to me that bears out what Buvver says, 
"Presbyterians believe in education."

Buvver and Daddy were married then, soon after graduation on August 18, 1917. I don't know what

happened during this time. How soon Daddy went in the service; well., little Earle would have been 
born just a year after they were married. I don't know whether they were living in Darlington or 
Greenville; my guess is that Buvver was in Darlington, while Daddy was in the army, and then after 
he was mustered out of the army they went to Greenville to live and was part owner of the Crosswell 
grocery store in Greenville and also Daddy worked at Woodside Mill. Now, I was born in Greenville, 
March 36, 1920.

Now there was between that time that you were born, there are letters from GiGi to Buvver when he 
was at Greenville working for Mr. Woodside. And there is documentation of him saying he was talking 
to Mr. Woodside about buying a house. That must have been before Buvver was moved to Greenville. 
Right, and in his letters the only reference I could find to James Earle Jr., was as "the boy". He 
always ended the letters, "a heartful of love to you and the boy." (Picture 6)

Well, you see, this has never been made clear, because they did not talk about that time in their 
lives. Evidently, he was mustered out of the service, Buvver had been in Darlington; he went to 
Greenville and was there at this point of which you were talking. He was without Buvver and was 
looking for a house, to bring her and "the boy" up there to live. It must be that they were at 
Cedar Mountain, and this is what I have always heard, when Earle, Jr. took ill and was taken to 
Saluda, where he died. Florence Edwards Horton did not remember the exact dates as to where they 
were living, but I think we got it through the picture of this period between the ending of W.W. I 
and the death of JE Jr.. And they continued on in Greenville and I was born there, and they lived 
there until 1922; that's when we went to Atlanta. (Death Certificate)
At that time was he still working with the grain company? No the grain company didn't come until 
Atlanta. So he went to Atlanta specifically for the job? Right, the brothers; Uncle Bub who was WJ; 
Uncle Harry, that's the one we called father; Uncle Gower, that's the oldest and Uncle Mark and 
Daddy, owned WL Fain Grain Co.
There was a real connection with Tom Shelton's wife, Virginia, and the Fains. Virginia's Aunt Nell 
was her great aunt and she was also my aunt by marriage to Uncle Bub. But they bought WL Fain grain 
and all went to Atlanta, except Uncle Mark who went to Houston, Texas.
Where would they have stayed at Cedar Mt.? Oh, at Cottage Rest. Now this is where we got to know 
everybody. There was Aunt Margaret's room, Aunt Mary's room and Grandmother's room; Aunt Kate's 
room. We would all be up there at the same time. Uncle Mark had five children; that's the Houston 
crowd, so they had a separate cottage and it was called Camp Houston. And since they gave it up it 
has had several owners and the present owners are the Steinberg's from Tampa. And there daughter 
recently bought the Bishop property, which is absolutely wonderful because it is adjacent to 
their's.
Where is that? As you are leaving Cottage Rest and going towards Caesar's Head. Uncle Mark's Camp 
Houston is on the right, over there by Eugenia, and the Bishop property is on a little farther than 
that. And Camp Houston is where those signs in the back of the garage came from? Yes. Henry Markley 
Crosswell, Flay, Jimmie and Nancy.

What were the signs for? The Cottage. They would put it outside to identify the cottage in the 
summer time, just like there is an Earlewood sign. We would all be up there in a crowd together, 
and I can remember much about that. When the time came to divide up the summers for the different 
families, our family was the only one that could make use of it, so we stayed and used it most of 
all. When we got to the teen ages, there are really some great memories of the family in Cedar Mt.  
Willie told me, I don't remember the date, the exact time, he said he used to be in bed in a front 
room in Cottage Rest, and he'd hear all of us out onthe porch, talking and laughing and playing games-all of the adults and teenagers, too. They really 
weren't silly, you had to think some.  Willie would hear everything that was going on. He was 8 
years younger than I and had been put to bed. And what came across to me was that he felt being the 
tail end of our family and the tail end of the whole Crosswell family, and he was left out. I could 
see that, and I think this has been proven, he wanted his children to get everything that we had 
gotten, plus what he had gotten in later years, but never like we did, because of this big gap. I 
remember Buvver never ever made me take care of Willie or make him my responsibility. She always 
wanted me to take care of Peggy and wanted Peggy to be with me no matter where I was.  I can 
remember we used to hike a lot, even before we got into the teens, and walking down to Lydia falls 
which is on the way to Stone Lake; I took Willie on my back all the way. He was three and I was 
eleven. We used to take him down to Bunyan's; that was the grocery store. Willie was very pretty. 
We used to dress him up like a girl and take him to the store. 'Ole Bunyan was a real raw old 
mountaineer; I can remember Willie would go down there and say, "Bunyan, Bunyan I declare, you got 
tootie bugs in your hair!" He had a slot machine. It was not against the law, and we used to play 
that.
Bunyan was Ruby Skerret's father. Buvver and Daddy, in particular Daddy, saw to it that we knew the
mountains, that we knew where they had been growing up: Corn's Mill, High Falls, all of those 
places.

At this time was that property owned by Dupont? No.  There were three waterfalls on Little River; 
there are two others besides that High Falls, and we used to go over there later as teenagers and 
we used to take Sunday night suppers and cook at the top of the falls. Gower Crosswell, who was the 
second to the oldest cousin knew more about the mountains than any of us did, because he was up 
there for a period of time, and we learned much from him. He was the first to take us to Raven 
Cliff. He also showed us the other falls on the Little River. Let me see...High Falls, Triple Falls 
and there was another...We could ride across the top of highfalls in a car. Daddy used to take us 
for long rides and point out the mountains and tell us how they used to go over to Mount Mitchell 
in the Black Mts., and he would remind us that Mt. Mitchell is the highest peak east of the 
Mississipi. We used to sit out on the big rock in front of Cottage Rest, and I don't know who did 
it, maybe it was Harry, maybe it was Frances Cary, they were older than we were, they would tell us 
ghost stories. And we'd get sooo scared. But we created our own entertainment, and I really think 
that's what today's generations miss. We found so much to do just around the Cottage. We used to 
play kick the can; all ages. I mean we used to have a ball playing kick the can. There was another 
called sardines; have you ever heard of sardines? You see, your daddy wanted to do everything we 
did.

But he was too young? Yes. And what you said was that he wanted us to have.... He wanted all of you 
all to have at
Cedar Mt. what we had. Now, Aunt Mary bought Cottage Rest from the brothers. Then in 1948, Buvver 
and Daddy bought Earlewood. It was built in '39. Buvver was absolutely miserable. She used to sew 
until 12:00 o'clock at night so she would go to sleep. She didn't want to leave Atlanta. She was 
wedded to Atlanta. She would work herself to death so she could go to sleep at night.

In 1948 you were how old? I was 28 and I was living in Miami. Peggy was living in Atlanta, and 
Willie was at the University of North Carolina. He graduated from high school, North Fulton, and 
went to Castle Heights for a year and on to the University of North Carolina. Where was Castle 
Heights? Lebanon, Tennessee. And did he play football there? No, it was a military school. Let's 
see, we left a big gap. While we were concentrating on Cedar Mt. and didn't say anything about Log 
Gables, and what happened before that. When he was born we were living on Brookhaven Drive, I 
described the house to Skeet, and I believe that that house is still there. We had three acres 
right across from the Brookhaven Lake. It was a big English style house. The grounds were 
beautiful. For that day and time it was a magnificent house. Willie was born while we were still 
living there; some of the facts that surrounded his birth were unbelievable.  I never knew
at eight years that I was going to have a brother or sister; pregnant was a word that was not in 
our vocabulary; nothing was ever said about it. If Buvver ever got fat, we didn't notice it.

When you were 8 what were your memories of Buvver and GiGi; how did they act toward each other? 
Were they loving toward each other?

Oh yes. Buvver ran the household and managed everything about the house; and Daddy always had a 
garden, and he also had a cow; anywhere that we lived, we would have a cow. He had a cow when we 
lived on Brookhaven Drive; most of the lot was in Dekalb County... What was the name of the cow, do 
you remember? No, I don't know whether we ever named the cow. Daddy used to kid me because part of 
the lot was in Fulton County, and you looked down your nose at Dekalb County. And he used to tell 
me that I would have to go down and live in the cow lot with the cow, because that was the part of 
the lot that was in Fulton county, where R.L. Hope school was. In 1927, Peggy had stayed over in 
Darlington all the time before Christmas and she came on back to Atlanta when we did after 
Christmas. We went to Darlington for every Christmas until I was a junior in college. Peggy and I 
used to rebel because we wanted to stay in Atlanta.
And Willie loved Darlington. Because of your friends? Yes. Why would I want to go to Darlington for 
Christmas? Why wouldn't I want to go back to Atlanta and see my friends, so finally they broke down 
and we had Christmas in Atlanta. But, I can't remember Peggy during the period before Willie was 
born, but in reconstructing the facts, I can say I don't remember Daddy, but I can say that we were 
much in the care of our next-door neighbors, who were the van Valkenbergs. And one of them I think 
Mrs. Van announced that we had a baby brother. And I never will forget, Buvver came home in an 
ambulance with Willie.
Peggy, Ed Van and I were up on the roof of the house dancing naked. There was a sleeping porch on 
this house, and you could crawl out of the sleeping porch and onto the roof. We saw that ambulance 
coming and we got in the house in a hurry. (Picture 7)

Did you get in trouble?  They never knew about this. But I stayed in trouble. Daddy said I was the 
leader. I got everyone else in trouble. We ran away one day. We went to visit the wash woman who 
lived on the other side of Peachtree and of course Brookhaven was a "metropolis" then, and you 
didn't cross Peachtree as you knew one T-model came along every week or two. But we walked over to 
Camie's and turned around and went back across Peachtree and started down Brookhaven Drive toward 
the house and Buvver came along and Daddy, and they were very much upset. They took us home and we 
had our choice of a switchin', taking castor oil or spending time in our room. Well, I chose the 
castor oil!

Caster oil, what would happen when you took castor oil? Well, it didn't happen because they had 
forgotten that the toilet was there. But I was always the leader of that kind of stuff.  I always 
got Peggy in trouble. And I said not too long before Daddy died, why did you switch me so much?  
You never touched Peggy, and he would say, "'cause you were so stubborn".  All I remember about 
Willie is that he was red; he was born at Davis Fischer Hospital which is now Crawford Long and not 
too long after that Daddy bought a Graham- Paige car. I can remember riding one Sunday in the 
Graham-Paige to get mileage on it. All the Family and Henry Crosswell went to Dalonega, GA, because 
we were going to Darlington; we were taking Willie for the first time. Now, Howdy always appeared 
on the scene when there was a baby. She came to help and she was a great great, help. But I can 
remember going to Darlington, going up the "Avenue" at Fairview, as they called it, and they had 
this funny little hat that they put on Willie, he would have been two months old. So having this 
funny little hat on his head upon his arrival was how he was introduced to Fairview. Later,
viii

we went down to Pawley's and of course that was just pure primitive at that point. We had the old 
Howard Cottage. Pawley's pier is on the site of that old Howard Cottage. I can still see the kiddie 
coop with Willie in it and a mosquito net over it. In September, 1928, Granny died. And later we 
had the Depression and the crash of the stock market.

Did that effect your family? I will tell you what Daddy did; it could have affected us, but he 
swapped the big house that we had on Brookhaven Drive outright for a duplex on Penn Avenue, 803 
Penn Avenue and this is still a good address. Eddie and I rode by there not too long ago, and it 
looked fine.  Somebody ought to go by and take a picture of that. And I didn't say anything about 
Virginia Circle near Highland Drive.
That's where we lived for the first year or so after we came to Atlanta. Then we rented a place 
that Buvver always referred to as the Marrietta car line. The street car came by there even though 
it was way out in the country. This was the first time I ever remember Peggy.  One thing that I 
remember about her is that we had an agate pan for the Chicken's water(Picture 6), and she sat down 
in the chicken's water. And then the other thing I remember about her was somebody running up to 
the street car tracks to get her; she was sitting on the tracks.  And that's really all I remember 
about that place, except Granny and Buvver's cousin, Mary Edwards and Aunt Emmy, Papa's sister, 
came over to visit. It's hazy you see 'cause I was only 3-4 years old, and then we moved to 
Brookhaven.

And how long did you live at Brookhaven? Four years. 1924-1928.  Daddy swapped it outright for the 
duplex on Penn Avenue during the depression, so we had the income from the unit upstairs.  He was 
sharp. We did rent for one year before we got settled in town in a house on Piedmont Road not too 
far from R.L. Hope school, and that's where all of us went to grammar school. It no longer exists, 
but it was an excellent grammar school, and that's where all of the kids in that area used to go 
before going on to North Fulton.

Do you remember much about you and Peggy; did you get in many fights at all? Oh, did we ever! They 
were always about clothes. Always. Were ya'll spoiled children or were you disciplined? We were 
disciplined; we were very definitely disciplined. By both Buvver and Daddy. Who gave the worse 
spanking? Well, both of them were pretty handy, Buvver used a flat brush on me, and Daddy used to 
talk about his strap. And that was his belt.
But Peggy and I literally fought until the last fight that we had I was 16 years old.  Buvver got 
the yard stick-this was at Log Gables- and started chasing us, and I ran in the closet and slammed 
the door on my finger.  We'd get each other down on the floor in the living room and sit on top of 
each other. And we were always the same size. Peggy was large for her age, and I was about average. 
She was very sloppy with clothes and anything else; she didn't take care of anything. And I was 
particular. She would go and take my clothes and it would burn me up.  And then we would start a 
fight and this continued while we were at the University of Georgia; we would fuss, then.  I was at 
Lucy Cobb, we were on the telephone fussing about a dress of mine, that she wanted to wear.

So you were a senior when she was a freshman? No, I was a Junior.  My house mother asked somebody 
if I got along with my sister. We got along fine until she got in my clothes. Buvver thought we 
were "twins", so she used to dress us alike.  I'd get the pink dress; Peggy, the blue dress. And 
Buvver continued that until we graduated from college. Once when we were adults in Miami, she 
bought us identical dresses if we would agree to wear them.  She never got over the fact that she 
thought we were "twins". Then, Willie came along; I remember when we were in high school, we made 
him learn how to dance. We used to dance on the green rug in the living room at Log Gables. Back to 
Penn Avenue, I so distinctly remember Willie there: he had the blonde curls. There were three 
little boys, and they all dressed in little navy blue overcoats and little navy blue berets. Each 
had a tricycle. We had a cook and in the afternoon she would be a nurse
 

and all cooks would take the little boys out on the tricycles, and they looked sooo cute in the 
little outfits. During that period on Penn avenue, we had a crisis: I had Scarlet Fever in 1930, 
and I was quarantined in the bedroom with an RN for five or six weeks.  And Willie was in his crib 
and in some way broke a bottle of gingen violet, and sat in it, which had roasted his bottom. He 
looked like a purple Easteregg!  They decided that he ought to go to Darlington to escape scarlet 
fever and they sent Peggy to Aunt Margaret's and Father's.  She got the flu, so Daddy took Willie 
to Darlington and left him with Sis. Sis was a real strange person, but she had this quarantine 
sign on her house and she was just tickled to death 'cause nobody could come to see her.  So Willie 
got over there, and he got scarlatina. So Daddy has to go back to Darlington and bring Willie to 
Atlanta.  In 1932 the depression was over for us, and Daddy had bought those five acres on Wieuca 
Rd., north of Buckhead.

What did the nurse do for you during that time? Everything 'cause she had to stay in that room with 
me. They had a curtain hanging down in the doorway. They would bring the food and passit through 
there, and when it was over, I think I was there for five weeks, Daddy wrapped me up in a sheet and 
took me and dropped me in a tub "seasoned" with Lysol. Got all the germs off. After I got well I 
had missed so much school that I had to be tutored, Buvver sent me plus Willie back to Darlington. 
Anytime she didn't know what to do with one of us she would pack that one up and ship her over to 
Darlington.

Was Buvver a good mother? Oh yes. She brought me up to be independent, although, as I said, she 
never made me take care of your daddy. You know so many times with that age gap, they would make 
you turn into a nurse but they never did that.  I used to spend alot of time away from home, in 
that I liked girl scouts and stuff like that, and at that point I don't know what Peggy was doing 
with herself, and, of course, Willie was just a little boy, and he would be with his friends there. 
I can still tell you the name of his friends: Nancy Reagen's first cousin lived next door to us and 
there were just real nice families who at the end of the depression moved out to the Buckhead area, 
and many of them went to the Tenth street school where we went during that gap.  Daddy had bought 5 
acres on Wieuca Rd. There was a log cabin on the site. This was pulled down and became a part of 
Log Gables. In the 1980s Log Gables sold for $1,00,000.

We all went to N. Fulton, also E. Rivers.  In '32, Willie was four when we went to Wieuca Road. 
Before we leave Penn Avenue, Daddy always got these large boards. Now I don't know what these had 
to do with WL Fain, but he would put four of them together and make a sand box. And there was a 
garage with double swinging doors, and Buvver said she looked out one day and coming out of the 
garage behind the doors there were three fountains, and that would be Willie Crosswell, Freddy 
Hauser, and Bobby Cunningham tee- teeing.  Those little boys were soooo cute dressed up in little 
overcoats and little berets. Then we moved out to Wieuca, and we had a series of cooks, and finally 
we got Liza. Willie and Liza were big buddies. Prior to that we had had a black man who took us to 
and from school. Buvver always had a cook. We always had help. And you asked about cows. Well we 
had a cow out there and kept the cow until Daddy got typhus fever and couldn't milk the cow, so he 
gave up on that. But during this period of animals, we had two pigs daddy was fattnin'. Willie 
named them Anne and Peggy. And we had this DUMB 'ole girl working for us, her name was Essie and 
she would take a corn cob and scratch the pigs backs.  They butchered the pigs and spread the meat 
all over the table on the back porch, and Peggy and I were humiliated that our dates should come in 
and see all that tacky meat, all of that pork, out on that back porch; that was just terrible.

Would you and Peggy double date? Yes, some. Did ya'll ever compete for the same boy? NO. What was 
your first date like? I don't remember. When I was at Tenth Street during that period we were in 
town, we were having
boy and girl parties. I can remember in 5th grade I had a crush on Otis Allen Barge, Jr., and I 
wrote OAB over everything. He came out to N. Fulton. He and his wife were in Peggy and Spencer's 
wedding. In fact Alvin called on Christmas day. He was just a real, real good friend. Your Daddy 
knew him well. He used to be out at the house alot. Let's see, where were we, you were asking about 
first dates....I couldn't tell you
and we did double date some. Spencer started dating Peggy in high school, and she was extremely 
popular.

What was she like in high school? Oh she always beautiful...really really pretty. There was a bunch 
of those girls they were definitely the Atlanta Pinks. They were all real popular. It is very 
interesting to look back on it and see how many of those that were so popular that have had failed 
marriages.

Would you consider yourself as one of the populars? No. I like to be included, but Peggy strictly 
out-shined me all the way; I liked school and sports and I had a lot of other things that I did. I 
was very interested in the academic side of high school. What sports did you play? Basketball. 
Softball. Volleyball. Track. Swimming. I'll have to back up and say N. Fulton had no athletic 
program. We had seven years of grammar school and four years of high school- only had eleven years, 
so you see we didn't have sports unless you chose to go out; they were not included. We didn't have 
PE. You volunteered to play basketball -women and girls?- yes. They had a basketball team. It 
wasn't part of the curriculum. The football never was. N. Fulton was strictly college prepatory, 
scientific, commercial and home etc, take your choice. They did not go into music or the frills 
that they have today.  It was an excellent school; really excellent. I am not implying that it 
suffered because it didn't have the sports, but then when we went to Camp Dixie, I used to play, 
well all of us, Peggy and I and our friends, played softball, basketball, I didn't like tennis, so 
we stayed out doors alot. And I can remember skating up almost to the top of N. Stratford Road from 
Log Gables and then back to Log Gables. We were outdoors and I was outdoors much more than Peggy. 
But during this period of Wieuca, Willie was somewhat of a loner, because there was nobody nearby. 
There was great distances there. Of course, the cooks always became his good friends.  And Buvver, 
she used to come pick us up at N. Fulton with Willie. He had this cowboy hat and it was the ugliest 
, worst-looking hat and it used to distress me that Buvver would let him come over there with that 
horrible hat on; I said, "Don't let my friends see him in that horrible hat!" Teenager, that's the 
way you are, your mind goes. But I really don't know anything about Willie and RL Hope during that 
period because I was in high school and then in college an I graduated from Georgia the same day he 
graduated from RL Hope. There was that gap there.

During that period he became very attached to Uncle. He used to spend time over there in 
Darlington. There is a picture in Buvver's bedroom of Willie-I don't know who has it- this was as a 
little boy - not the curly headed one.  It hung on the wall at the foot of the big bed. Somebody 
has it That picture was in Elliot's window, Elliot's studio, I don't know whether that exists 
anymore, but it was at that point the finest photographer in Atlanta. And also the one of him with 
the curly hair was put on display out there. But it was during that period that he became so 
attached to Uncle. Uncle didn't get married until 1934, and Willie and this little Hay boy from 
Florence were in the wedding. And it was in a house in Florence, and Willie told me at some point 
that the gist of it was that it just upset him terribly when he married Anna, because Uncle had 
been his buddy and his friend, and now that didn't exist anymore. And that upset him.

And he was about six years old? Yes, he would have been six years. I was fourteen and I can 
remember Peggy and Daddy and I rode the train over to Uncle's wedding. That was the best means of 
transportation.
How long would that take? Oh golly I don't know it was at least 12 hours, maybe more. It was a long 
trip. But you had asked whether Buvver was a good mother. Yes, very definitely; Peggy and I 
particularly were
disciplined; we, on Saturday mornings, had to get up and clean our rooms and learn our Sunday 
school memory work before we could go out and play. We went to Sunday school and if we played sick, 
that was fine, you would go get in the bed. But you'd be just as sick in the afternoon as you were 
in the morning, you would stay in the room all day. And would ya'll play sick often? No. Also, we 
were not allowed to study on Sundays, and we could not have a date but all the boys could come see 
us. They would have fraternity meetings and then they would gather and go from one house to the 
other, and all these boys would descend on a house and we could see them but, yet, we couldn't have 
a date. Are these collective rules that GiGi and Buvver came up together? They both had the 
Presbyterian background, and I think Presbyterians put an emphasis on observance of the Sabbath. 
And I know when we lived on Penn Ave. We were not allowed to skate, or ride bicycles or be 
boisterous on the outside. Now that was as much for the neighbors to have a quiet day. It can work 
two ways. You could get out and start having fights and fusses and games and so forth and people in 
their homes trying to rest and having a quiet day. We couldn't dance on Sundays or go to a picture 
show or play cards. Actually, I never rebelled over any of that and I don't think Peggy did either, 
but if I ever did any of those things, she couldn't wait to go tattle.

This was something interesting that GiGi was writing Buvver when he was in Greenville and Buvver 
was in Darlington with James Earle Jr. He was telling Buvver about a fellow worker who was quitting 
his job where he was working in Greenville and going into the ministry to be an evangelist, and he 
quoted him as being a "bug in religion". What do you think he meant by being a "bug in religion"? 
Well, probably, you say that he was an evangelist, and Presbyterians have the reputation of not 
really being evangelical, although their beliefs are as solid as any beliefs you'll find anywhere. 
Let's say he probably would have been somebody who fit into the Billy Graham crusades. And that 
would have been something new to somebody who had been a Presbyterian back to Scotland. And I think 
that was something that was meant there.

I was trying to think about that period at Log Gables. Buvver was definitely a good mother she used 
to sew and we had a new evening dress, formal they call them now, for every occasion that arose; 
the only problem is that she made them just alike. We always had a cook and they referred to having 
good food as setting a good table. I guarantee you that Buvver set a good table; and probably equal 
to her was Martnee; they both set a good table. They always had a cook. We had breakfast in the 
dining room. Liza prepared breakfast. Buvver didn't get up to get us off to school or work, but 
Liza did. She would have the toast cut into triangles with the crust cut off and buttered. We ate 
dinner in the dining room and were served; Daddy always cut the meat and passed the plates.  The 
vegetables and soforth were served and we usually we had dessert, well the only kind we didn't like 
was bananas and cream.  Liza was an out-of-this-world cook. So we certainly had gracious living. 
And during that period it was the same exact way among our peers in Buckhead.  And later few maybe 
years, I can remember going to a couple of dinners, where there were all girls, and then another 
was but three couples, where we were served formally. People used the nicest things they had they 
didn't pull them out just once. But we could always have company for meals, and two things I 
remember, personally, it must have been my 17th Birthday, I was sitting at the desk, the desk that 
Dan and Lucy got, sitting at the desk studying, which I loved to do, and all of a sudden here were 
all these people.
Buvver had hidden Easter eggs and had an Easter egg hunt and had all of these girls for dinner; 
that waswhen I was seventeen.

Well, I can remember going off somewhere out of town, when I was twenty-two, I got back on my 
twenty- second birthday and she repeated it; she had a surprise Easter egg hunt for me. But we used 
to have company up at Cedar Mt., and Daddy would drive up on the weekends from Atlanta in an A 
model Ford, and he would have the car loaded with watermelons and chewing gum and candy and things 
from the farmer's market. We ate out on the back porch. Liza was always there; we ate dinner at one 
o' clock. She made the best coleslaw that anyone could ever make; that's the thing I remember. We 
ate big and well.
Then, at night we had the best peanut butter and mayonnaise sandwiches and hot chocolate. It was 
heavenly.  There was a rule that if we did not get back to Cottage Rest at supper time, we cleaned 
up the kitchen. And that big 'ole cow bell...now the Crofts have the original. I don't know if you 
have ever seen it, it was huge. When they rang that cow bell, you could hear it all over Cedar Mt., 
and when that cow bell rang, we knew, even as teenagers, that we better get home or we were going 
to have to wash dishes. And we used to have clean our rooms, and there was a time when we did not 
have water or electricity. We used to have to pump the water, as well.  This was back when I was 
14. We would have the pump outside the porch there would pump buckets full of water and bring 'em 
in and put them on the shelf on the back porch. Then we had a privy down in the back yard, and 
Peggy and I used to bathe out on the big rock in a zinc tub; it was fun. You see there is that 
period in there when I did not see much of Willie, I think he got up to high school, and I was home 
some but he had a trombone.  He could play one thing and it was "String of Pearls"; he would turn 
it on with Glenn Miller and play "String of Pearls"; that was the only thing he could play that I 
ever heard. He and I used to fight until he got to big, I guess I had the fighting spirit.
Peggy amazed me after she grew up. She was always so, well not aggressive, but boy she could really 
be
aggressive as an adult, but she never would have had the business that she had today; she really 
learned to be aggressive. But Cedar Mt. was really a great place.

Now, after Willie graduated I guess this was during the summer when he was not in school at the 
university, he used to come and be at Earlewood, and he worked as a clerk at the Franklin Hotel in 
Brevard. It is now the site of the Presbyterian Church, but there was a great big 'ole hotel there, 
and that's where GiGi and Buvver spent part of their honeymoon at the 'ole Franklin hotel. So he 
was around there and around our boys during that period and then after that before he was married. 
The crowd would be up there, and he would always come up there too, and Willie seemed to enjoy his 
nieces and nephews. There are pictures and you would always see Willie in there with the nieces and 
nephews and the whole family. During the period before we left Atlanta, this would be before he 
graduated high school, I can remember that he had
...well Charlotte's picture is in that bunch of pictures; Charlotte was one of his girlfriends and 
he had one named Ann Jentsen, and Buvver never liked Ann Jentsen; she married Ed Addison.

Do you know why she didn't like Ann Jentsen? I don't know whether I should put it on paper or not. 
Her family lived right near us on Virginia Circle, and Buvver says that some member of that family 
stole my great gold beads or some gold something I had on me off of me, so Buvver always thought 
they were po' buckras.
Now Charlotte was Dad's sweetheart?  I think so. I have not seen her since 1990, Peggy came over to 
clearwater and she and Buvver drove up from Palm Beach Gardens. We had a big luncheon for Buvver's 
94th Birthday.  I have pictures of it. Charlotte came; Charlotte lives in St. Petersburg.  I called 
her when Buvver died and I called her when Willie died, and I guess I got someone to call her when 
Peggy died. But Charlotte was a nice nice person. Do you know how long they dated?  Well, all 
through high school until he went to Tennessee.  He had a party one nite during the winter. We all 
were living there at Log Gables.
This had to be during W.W.II. We were married, and everybody came back to Log Gables, Peggy and Mot 
and the whole gang came back, but he had this party and it had been snowing or raining, and in the
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bathroom were these white towels. I never remember this little girl's last name but her first name 
was Ann, and she came in and her shoes were muddy. She went in the bathroom and wiped her muddy 
shoes with those white towels; I never got over that. That was just absolutely horrible, that 
anybody would do anything like that.(Letter 2)

How did they break up? I don't remember this but Frank says that her father got into some kind of 
trouble and she went to St. Pete to live with relatives and never came back to Atlanta, and I think 
it was just something that happened; I don't think there was any big break up. Just about the time 
that I graduated from GA and came home, Willie would have been just have graduated from RL Hope, he 
and George Dunbar, now what happened to George Dunbar, I don't know, and Mimi Wilkins and Martha 
Jones - I don't guess you could call them dates- they all sat on the back seat, and I drove them to 
Buckhead to go to the picture show. Mimi is dead and everybody in her family, except Jimmy, her 
oldest brother, are all deceased.  But see there's that gap when Willie was away at Castle Heights 
and then away at North Carolina. But we would always see each other at Cedar Mountain. He would 
come to Miami, and Bill Court would always appear on the scene. We would alternate Christmas 
between palm Beach and Miami and the same with Thanksgiving.

And Bill Court went to N. Fulton? Oh yes. He was a year older, and Ike and Tom Shelton. Do you 
remember them together? The troubles they got into? The only one I ever remember that got into 
trouble was George Dunbar. He, and I don't know if anyone else was involved or not, stole some 
typewriters and stuff from N. Fulton, from the classrooms.  I think that is authentic. As far as I 
know this is the period at which ( this was during W.W.II) the high school crowds started going out 
to the Pink Castle on West Paces Ferry, and I guess vandalizing and going inside. And this is one 
of the things in that Peachtree Road Book that made me so mad, was that her chronology was so 
horrible. Anybody my age was furious about that book. Anybody reading it would think well those 
were terrible people, was this what the South was like, is that what Atlanta is like?
These big places could not be kept up during W.W.II and you could not get the help.  The castle 
looked like it was 2 miles up from the road. You looked through the gate and you saw it sitting up 
on that hill; the last time I was up there there were houses all in between so you didn't get that 
view at all. We always had a big Christmas. If there was somebody who lost a family member or 
something they always were included in the dinner, anybody who would be lonesome.

What were Christmases like? Oh they were big! They were big and Buvver was a last minute person. 
She would be wrapping presents probably while she was cooking the turkey. She always came through 
and she was a good planner but I can remember how we were doing the Christmas tree the day before. 
But the house always looked pretty and we made a whole lot of it, particularly after we got out of 
going to Darlington. Something interesting about Darlingon was, and scary too, we would go with 
them to pick out a Christmas tree on Fairview, and it would always be a pine tree and most of the 
time that big pine tree was in the entrance hall.  They had these clips that held candle sticks, 
and you know they would light those candles. Now you talk about dangerous. I can still see that. 
Peggy and I were pets before Willie came along. Buvver had all of these male first cousins; we got 
all of the attention because there was no one else, I mean we were really petted.

I can remember these men and Uncle would come out to Fairview, and we would stand out in the big 
hall, and we would say, "Jump me, Jump me". And they'd take us and throw us up toward the ceiling. 
In the afternoon in the summer we would always go to Black Creek and take a swim. That's how we 
learned how to swim. We would go to Sis's place and there was the McIver's place and the 
Williamson's place. People
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still use "swimming holes" now. Now, Sis's has been sold. Of course, The Darlington Country Club is 
on Black Creek .

Later, Willie went with American Hospital Supply, and then he moved down to Murrells Inlet. We went 
to visit him and I always had Skeet and Mot with me; Skeet and Mot and Steve and sometimes a dog. 
And I can remember one time we stayed in the little house that ...did you ever live in the little 
house?

That's where Mark and Bright were born, right there at Dockside...right. We stayed there and I can 
remember Willie bought 5 Pounds of Shrimp and boiled them in beer, and he and Skeet and Mot and I 
ate those 5 lbs of shrimp. And this was just the time that Steve had a restricted license and there 
was that old bridge to Georgetown. So we started over that bridge one morning, we were leaving, and 
Steve had to drive, and he started over that bridge and he panicked. He got out from under that 
wheel, and I took it back; that little 'ole biddy bridge nearly scared him to death.  Now Steve was 
with you but not Dan? Now Dan was working on a high school project in Miami. Then he started going 
to summer school at Emory.  So as he got older he didn't travel as much with us but he did go 
through Murrells Inlet several times when he was there on the way to Darlington.  Buvver used to 
talk about, "Now you must see the folks in Darlington".  And it was really good 'cause they learned 
to know Ellen and Uncle. Now I am talking about my boys and Fairview.

How was everybody's relationship with Buvver and GiGi?  I think probably over the years, I related 
better to Buvver. She made me independent and she made Peggy dependent. She would tell Peggy 
everything to do. And this actually carried on into adult life and actually into Buvver's and 
Peggy's last few years. They didn't get along, as well. As I told Skeet, this was a pattern that 
was set.  Buvver always told Peggy just what to do. And I said here now as an adult, she is telling 
Peggy, an adult, what to do and finally Peggy rebelled.
And so I told Peggy I said,"now look, this is your fault". "When Buvver comes down to clearwater to 
stay, I make it plain to her that I am in charge". I said, of course, we were delighted to have 
her.  She gets all of her doctor's appointments, medical care, clothes shopping and everything, and 
I just made it plain to her that if she was going to stay that long, we were going to function on 
my schedule. Peggy would say," Buvver did so and so, and she owes me money, and she didn't pay me 
back,"  I said, "well, that's your fault; that's not Buvver's fault." I would say that my 
relationship was better. Buvver always thought that she had to take care of Peggy. And Peggy had 
all the children and Buvver felt she needed her help and her care, whereas I was more independent. 
Now probably Peggy was closer to Daddy although we always got along, and I really respected him in 
every way. He was the disciplinarian, and he was the businessman and he took charge of everything 
in the financial realm. Frank and I laugh about this: every Friday morning Buvver had a standing 
appointment for her hair in Brevard.  And for some reason it made Daddy mad that she wanted to do 
that, and he would say, "Helen's gone to the hair dresser". And we never understood why it irked 
him so.

Why do you think that is? I do not know. 'Cause he had the truck; he was not left without the 
wheels; he had the money; she was not throwing away his money: "Helen's gone to the hair dresser". 
Was Buvver social?
Oh very social. Was she overly social? No, no but she was social, and Peggy was social. Was GiGi 
social? No. GiGi and I were alike. I like my share of it but I don't thrive on it. Was this a 
social move for Buvver? No. It was just a matter that Buvver had so much hair. I tried to roll her 
hair up one time and I couldn't. It was amazing how much hair she had. It was a matter of if I 
couldn't do it, she surely couldn't do it. So she always had that beauty parlor appointment. She 
got her hair washed and shampooed. But she was a people's person and Peggy was a people's person. 
And everybody was welcomed at Earlewood. But she also had her dislikes. That was behind the scenes, 
because we always heard her on the porch talking about her views. Did
she and GG ever fight? If they did we never knew it. Never ever knew it. She never worried about 
anything. Well, Daddy always took care of anything that she would ever have to worry about. And 
then in his failing years she really took good care of him. And I thought that she was dependent to 
the extent I really wondered how she would get along. Well she got along just fine. She had guts. 
And stayed up at Cedar Mt. alone.  She used to drive down to Atlanta, and I told her, "if you 
continue that lifestyle of running around the country all alone in the car, I am not going to be 
responsible." While she was still driving, I said, " I don't mistrust your driving, it was what 
could happen to you if the car breaks down; what could happen to you if you go into one of these 
rest stops and you get robbed. It's that kind of thing that I worry about with you."

Did Buvver cry when Gigi died? I never saw her cry. You never saw her cry? Yes. But not really over 
a death. What did she cry over? I can remember once we were leaving and she thought we were not 
coming back soon, and she started crying, I can't remember the circumstances. But not many times 
and I never saw Daddy cry. And I can remember after Peggy died before the service, one of the 
children said, and I believe it was Mot, "Now Mama always said we do not cry at funerals". So this 
might have been a way that they were brought up, you didn't cry over sadness, and if you wanted to 
cry, you cried alone. And that's all I can think of. But I did see Buvver cry, but only on rare 
occasions. I can't really tell what they were all about.

Was G.G. affectionate? No. Was he playful? Oh yes, he teased. He used to loved to tease Steve and 
Mike. He loved to play checkers with Steve. They had a good time together; they were big buddies. 
Daddy would fuss about Skippy, that was our dog. He would come and visit. Skippy liked to ride in 
the truck which we called A-model truck , the Coup de Ville. Skippy would be out in the yard and 
he'd hear that truck start and he'd come running around the house.

Buvver said he couldn't wait for that dog to get in that truck with him. And Buvver had or rather 
this cat took a liking to the house. He would always come back to Earlewood when Buvver and Daddy 
were there; nobody knows were he was during the winter. He was a beautiful big black and white cat, 
and Buvver named him Sir Thomas. She used to make up these tales about sir Thomas, and I don't know 
whether any of the other kids would or not, but Steve would come down to get in bed with Buvver and 
she would make up these stories about how sir Thomas went and got in the Coup de Ville and drove 
all over Cedar Mt. picking up all these cats and took them to ride all over the mountains. And 
Steve knew it wasn't true, he had to know it wasn't true, but he was so interested to know. But 
things were improved all along at Earlewood. From the pictures I saw there were no plantings in 
front of the house, it was just a farmhouse. Of course, they made it into a show place.  There was 
no cement on the floor in the garage; it was just dirt. And Skeet and Mot and Dan and Steve used to 
go in there in the summer and dig a hole in the floor, and after they left, Daddy had to get a 
truckload of dirt to fill up the hole they had dug in the floor. And one of the funniest things 
that had ever happened was Skeet and Mot were playing in that dirt in the garage one summer, and as 
I said I always had them along with my two. I was sitting up on the front porch. But I could hear 
everything they were saying, and so they were arguing over who picked her nose, and one of them 
said to the other, "Well you pick your nose too." And the other said, "But, I don't eat it!"

 

Well who was the one who ate it? I don't know which one was which; I couldn't see 'em. One 
Christmas, we have lots of pictures of that Christmas and Tim wouldn't go to sleep, and he would 
want his BiKICKle,
xvi

Santa Claus was bringing him a BiKickle, and he would come down the stairs and he said, "Tee Fire, 
Tee Fire"; the fire would be going and he wanted to see the fire. Dan got a record player with a 
record of little black sambo. Skeet spent the whole time listening to the little black sambo 
record, "HoHoHo, HoHoH, I'm going to eat you up". Skeet got a baby carriage, and Steve pushed the 
doll carriage around while Skeet played little black sambo.{Now we know the origins of HNIC!}

And they played in the branch, the branch they called it, and they all would be building a dam down 
in the branch. And this is what's so good. They had their own entertainment. They didn't have to be 
entertained; they didn't have to be taken someplace else to have what I call artificial 
entertainment. And there was no television way back then. It got to the point when GiGi and Buvver 
finally did get one. And they had the first telephone around the area and everybody used to come to 
use the telephone, which was good.

What was GiGi's involvement with Faith Memorial? He was a Trustee. Was he one of the Founders? No. 
There was an old chapel across the road from Cottage Rest and it was an Episcopal Chapel. The 
Chapel became interdenominational. There are all kinds of people there and of course there are all 
kinds of ministers. But there is a picture I want to have blown up, and it is of the four men with 
all of the men with the equipment they used to clean the Chapel. They had their brooms, mops,etc., 
and it was a funny little picture with Mr. Perkins, Rabb, Daddy and Mr. Barr.(Newspaper)

What were your first impressions of Nancy?  Well Willie called and said they were going to be 
married and he told me all about her... But before that?  I had never seen her. And she came down 
at Christmas time and was up at Palm Beach....Now this was after Frank was on the Orange Bowl 
committee. We had Christmas dinner with the Crowley's, and my first impressions were I was just 
delighted. And I can remember Buvver saying, "Now kiss your sister-in-law." This was in December 
1962, before they were married in February. So they came back to Miami, not in the same car, but 
came back with us, and I can remember having a light snack of some kind and I don't know if it was 
that nite or not but we went over to the beach where the Alabama team was staying, and Leroy Jordan 
was playing for Alabama. We showed them the beach, some of the hotels and the Orange Bowl party and 
whatever was related to the Orange Bowl, and Bear Bryant was there that time and Nancy went up and 
started a conversation with him. I believe, for some reason, she talked with Leroy Jordon. The next 
morning, we went outside, and we had been replugging centipede grass, and there were alot of 
cuckleburrows in it. Nancy was out there barefooted, and I can remember Willie picked her up and 
carried her across the lawn so she wouldn't get her feet stuck. My first impression was very 
favorable, and then in February I went up to the wedding and enjoyed that. They came back down the 
next December, and it was at point we went to all the Orange Bowl festivities, the coronation ball, 
parade and game. Mark was a baby, and I had my yard man to baby sit him, but I can remember going 
to the Orange Bowl parade and we went to the coronation ball. The next year, December 1965, they 
came down to Mot and Lynn's wedding, and Willie was in the wedding and there's a picture in there 
of Willie at the wedding with Buvver and Frank. All along everything was favorable and I have 
gotten along with Nancy. (Picture 7)

What are your memories of Dad from the time he graduated school 'til the time he was married at age 
34? Did he date much?
Oh yes. We would see him in intervals. He would come and we would see him on special occasions, in 
the summers he would come to Cedar Mt. We kept in touch; he had several dates and girlfriends; one 
of them was Waddy McAlister, and Buvver would say when she saw these people, "Now, he's not going 
to be marrying that one!".  But I can't remember all of them because I wasn't there; but he always 
had a girlfriend. And Buvver could give you the names of the girlfriends and the ones she liked and 
the ones she didn't. Did she like most of them? If she didn't like them she would just say, well, 
he's not in love with her, and didn't
xvii

make any issue out of it. Waddy McAlister is the only one I remember.

Was Dad a Mama's boy? Well, I wouldn't say that. He was real close to Buvver. I think a mama's boy 
is someone who is totally dominated by a mother and can't really have any thought of his own, any 
independent thoughts. As I said he was very close to Buvver rather than she manipulating him he did 
a darn good job of manipulating her. He was the only one that she ever listened to. For instance, 
when she went into assisted living, she listened to Willie, and she would listen to me on the 
clothes and the house, and so forth but on a big decision like driving she wouldn't listen to me, 
and all Willie had to do was to say, now the time has come, but he wouldn't do anything about it.  
He had the influence with her. She did call on him for certain things, but there was a time that 
she called on all of us. Before that I was usually the one she called on for things other than 
business. I would not call him a mamma's boy. (Picture 8)

Was he charming? He would kid her and she just ate it up, and yet she wouldn't hear from him and 
she would gripe about that. I don't think she dominated his life, now somebody else might look on 
it in a different way, but I think he had a life of his own.  You might say that she spoiled him. 
Anytime he was coming around she could hardly wait to make an angel pie and a pound cake, and 
whatever he liked and she got to be that it was the same way with Frank, but if it were Anne, I had 
some fresh corn bread. But she liked males; she liked men. Would she flirt? No, I think that would 
have been beneath her. I don't think she would have done that. She liked to talk to them and she 
just liked them period, but I don't think of her as flirtin'.

Did GiGi ever have any hobbies? He loved to work on his books and his estate- he kept all of his 
estate until he had that stroke in 1970. He did all the income tax, and he used to save any slip 
that had the sales tax on it. And he would go up there to his little office, and Willie called it 
the 'crow's nest'; he wanted to escape the confusion downstairs, he would just go up there in that 
office. Was Gigi ever aloof? He did not mind being alone. He did not have to be with a bunch of 
people. Buvver had to go find some people, and if she didn't find them, she would be on the phone 
with them. She was a people's person, and yet she could be alone, but she just started 
conversations with anybody that would come along. G.G. loved sports, reading, gardening and bridge.

...And Buvver was on the Basketball team her junior and senior years at Winthrop, and she was 
president the of the junior class; and the senior class. Now she's got a year book? Yes, and she 
had a scrapbook and she had the Tattler-you want some gum?; oh yes, I haven't chewed a piece in 
years- In the house at Fairview there is a back bedroom that opens on to the old back porch and 
Papa used to sleep in there. Everybody called it the nursery, and I guess after everybody grew up 
that became his bedroom. One night when he was asleep an old car went through the yard. He thought 
somebody was stealing his car so he jumped out the window to stop them. Something else that's funny 
to me of course I was , this had to be 1927, must have been the Christmas before Willie was born, 
and Peggy was already in Darlington and Buvver and Daddy and I left Atlanta one morning (this was 
when we lived on Brookhaven) and we had this T-model coup, and there was this space behind the 
front seat, and I could get into this space. We set out to drive to Darlington and we always 
stopped in Aiken with Aunt Mary and Uncle Ed and Ed Jr.,and Crosswell and John, and I don't know 
where these particular things happened, but I think we had four flat tires.  I can remember 
arriving in Darlington, Buvver said it was 3 am. Granny had a fire going in the living room. Buvver 
said that Granny was just crazy about Daddy and so was Sis. Granny was strictly the homebody. She 
was the cook. Buvver even said she had a winter garden. She was a fabulous cook along with Howdy, 
Buvver and Martnee. They really were something.
Her funeral was the first one that I ever went to; the first death that I was ever really close to. 
It was in September 1928, there were floods and all the way to Darlington. They were sandbagging 
the roads. It was raining hard, and I can remember Buvver was sitting in the back seat holding some 
little Pagonia flowers.
The coffin was in that room behind the living room-it was open. Granny was in that coffin, the 
little pagonias were all around her body. I can remember looking in there and Aunt Maimee, her 
sister, was standing by me, and she said, "Now, you look at your Grandmother, because you will 
never see her again."

You see this was my first time of anything that close to death; then the funeral; it was pouring 
and pouring and pouring; we were in cars-Dudley's law partner had a chauffeur. I think his name was 
Fred, and I was sitting in the front seat of that car, at the funeral with Howdy and Fred. It was 
really gruesome. And another thing about Buvver is this, which I never asked her about: everytime 
we moved there was a little sweetheart bush, that had little, tiny roses, pale pink, that she had 
brought from Darlington. Every house we moved to, that little rose went. It definitely had some 
connection, but I don't know if it was connected to little Earle, or not. Brought it from 
Darlington and it was planted everywhere we went; had little sweetheart roses.

Do you know where it is now? Oh no. I don't know whether it died in Atlanta or what, but it made 
the rounds. Talking about strange things that happened, Uncle Bub was the second oldest brothers of 
the Crosswells, and Buvver, Peggy and I were going to Darlington for some reason, and I don't know 
where Daddy was, but he could not take us to the train station, and Uncle Bub took us to the train 
station and it was an overnight ride to Darlington, and we got on the train and down the road, and 
found that Uncle Bub had put our tickets in his pocket. We were on the train with no tickets and no 
money-we had to be real little, Peggy was probably a baby- and we were all going to sleep in the 
same berth. This nice woman took us on, and I slept with her. He died in 1934 and Papa died two 
weeks later when he was visiting us in Atlanta.

Did Sis ever get married? No. I've got a picture, I gave you, of her fiance's tombstone in 
Darlington; it's the most elaborate of all, Mr. Ardie Dargan. He died the day that they were to get 
married. I don't know the cause.  Sis was a real character. She lived by herself in that big 'ole 
house; she had chickens; and she would go out at nite with her gun and shoot at the possums that 
got after her CHICKENS!  And Martnee was a crack shot. Mr. Dargan's tombstone is the big fancy 
cross...and incidentally, Frank and I have bought a plot in the Darlington cemetary. I'm "strange", 
because I love to look in cemeteries for facts; that's where you get so much, when the facts aren't 
recorded any place you go up to church records...

{The Darlington Presbyterian Church was a real community. Among other things...} They would clean 
the floors and do all the heavy cleaning, and then there were the gardners, the ones who owned 
Rockbrook camp, but anyone they came from Hamp and were well trained, and you had them take care of 
the garden and keep the yard looking pretty, and Buvver always rewarded them with ice cream at the 
end of the day.
Homemade ice-cream?  No not at that point, but I tell you they used to churn that ice cream out on 
that little back porch, that fresh peach, or that fresh raspberry you talk about something good; 
your daddy would churn it, and we'd all take a shot until it was so hard you couldn't churn it 
anymore. In the days of Earlewood, we used to churn that ice-cream and pull the dasher out for 
someone to lick it. How would you get the ice? Well, we had the freezer then.  They used to sell 
ice down at Bunyans. There is a picture of the old post office and the store. Before that the store 
was even smaller, and I don't what you'd call it, I guess a stopping place. When Bunyan died, Ollie 
(Ruby's husband) took over the store.

{Looking at some pictures}Now, I put that stuff in there and that's about our Martha's Vineyard 
ancestors.
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Our ancestor, Thomas Mayhew, was the first governor of Martha's Vineyard, Nantucket and Elizabeth 
Island.  He's on the Gower line, and our ancestors were all over- Edgartown, etc. Well, our 
ancestors put their feet down on it first of all before the Kennedy's.  I put a picture in there of 
big granite stones. They are thought to be markers of the colonists' graves. They didn't want the 
Indians to know about the deaths, so they had those granite markers. And if you ever go there, 
before you go see if you can get a local guide, I was really disappointed in our trip to Cape Cod 
because we had a guide that didn't know her history. I read a book on it and had read enough to 
take my own little tour and get things in my head. But going to a place like that that you're so 
connected to you ought to have your facts together. I was very disappointed in that tour, and I 
wrote to 'em and told them that I did not think our guides was up to the guides we had had 
previously. That place is just run over with history, that whole area of Cape Cod, from the bottom 
of the boot on up to where the first landing of the pilgrims came at Provincetown. There's a museum 
up there, and she didn't even tell us about ir until we got there. There was a big monument up 
there that was not kept up; that's the kind of stuff that bothers me, is not preserving history.

Dad had a friend up at Cedar Mt., a little black boy that he used to play with? No there never were 
any up there, unless he took them with him. When we were at Cottage Rest, Liza used ot go up with 
us every summer. There was a servants' quarters in the back. Liza stayed in there, and she did all 
the cooking, washing and ironing. And you were asking about ice. Before they had electricity, they 
used to deliver ice in hunks at Cottage Rest. There was an oak icebox as you go in the backporch 
door on the right hand side. They used to put the ice in that. There was a time and still is a time 
when those old ice boxes were treasure antique.
So I was up there one time, and the icebox was gone, so I asked, "Aunt Mary, where is the icebox?" 
And she said,"Oh, I gave it to Mr. Heeter." And I said, "What do you mean you gave it to Mr. 
Heeter? Why didn't you give it to ME?"  And he was an old man that had really taken Buvver and 
Daddy in, I never did like him; I never did trust him; and I think they, in the end, saw it, but he 
used to take care of the house and so forth. I think he really made money off of them; I think he 
took advantage of them. GG was getting on in years and I think he was really taking Daddy for a 
ride, and they were from the North, and they ended up going back to the North. But Cedar Mt. was a 
wonderful place... Do you remember how much they bought it for? Yes,
$19,000. Cash. They had sold the house in Atlanta, and Daddy had sold out his business. So he 
retired pretty early? Oh yes. He was 56. And one of the main reasons was the government. He used to 
shout about the government all the time, and that's where I got all my VIEWS. He used to fuss about 
Roosevelt, Fanny Perkins, Henry Hopkins, who else, but they were always meddling with his business. 
So he just up and sold his business and house and got out of Atlanta. He said that Atlanta is no 
place to retire, and it's not; you have to have money to retire there. They did the wise thing and 
Buvver loved Cedar Mt. more than any place on Earth, before it was all over.

It was interesting that we did not have running water and electricity in the days of Cottage Rest 
and the days of Sandy Cot down at the beach, at Pawley's; when you're talking to people from the 
midwest they talked about how they were brought up with privies. We never used privies except at 
the cottages.  We never ever had anything but running water at Sis's house and Fairview. All of 
these houses had privies, but were never used, unless there was something wrong with the indoor 
plumbing. But we had indoor plumbing all along, and it amazed me that my peers grew up with 
privies. There are two things about Grandmother Crosswell, who would be your Great Grandmother; 
there was a little back room at Cottage Rest. That was Grandmother's room. It always smelled like 
astipta dine- it's the heart of the pine tree. And it is put up in Wilmington, N.C., and I think 
you can still get it.  Grandmother always kept it to rub on stumped toes and mosquito bites and she 
used to keep little rags and we'd go barefooted and she would tie
our stumped toes and fingers up with these rags dipped in astiptadine. The room always smelled like 
it!   And sh
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goes, and I never heard it to be proven untrue, that Grandmother was out there on that back porch, 
and a skunk got up under her skirt.

Another thing I bet your Daddy never told you about, what he called BM and Teetee. Teetee was 
FooFoo; have you ever heard this? " I've got to FooFoo". And the other was, "BM was FooFoo the 
other way. "I got to FooFoo and I got to FooFoo the other way". And one thing that Meta contributed 
and it is my favorite part, instead of saying BM, "I gotta Huuhhh...." That's Meta's contribution 
and I think it's a pretty good name.

We used to go to Pawley's every summer; Uncle Ben Williamson, owned the cottage- Sandy Cot. It was 
quite an occasion. The cottage was lined up bedroom- bedroom- bedroom: a long line of bedrooms down 
there, and then a dining room in there and then this long porch. There was no living room. We would 
have a cook from down there and what they called a 'creek boy'. The creek boy would bring in all of 
the seafood; we would have fish or seafood three times a day they'd have fried fish for Breakfast 
with hominy.
The blacks would come around selling the big black figs, oh boy were they good. There was a lookout 
on top of the sand dunes; you couldn't even think about seeing over them to see the beach; these 
high, high sand dunes. Peggy and I were little. But all my Aunt's and Buvver's first cousins would 
be down there. We would go up to the lookout and sing and learn some of songs that I have never 
heard since; they were dirty. Peggy and I were the pets. This was back in the 20s, the late 
twenties.

Gigi would break prohibition? No cocktails were served at our house, at all. And not even any wine. 
They were not these fanatics. Buvver and Daddy went to New Orleans for a football game it was the 
Sugar Bowl: Georgia versus North Carolina. Daddy replayed that game until he went to his grave 
about the bad referee. Obviously UNC lost and we won. We used to have quite a battle. Buvver came 
back all hepped up about cooking with wine, 'cause she had been in all the New Orleans restaurants. 
Then, Daddy, after we were grown, served drinks but never had cocktail parties and they on occasion 
would serve spiked punch. Buvver was a teetotaler, but she wasn't a fanatic at all about it.

The boiler used to be a coal-burning boiler? I don't know. That's what we had on Wieuca. However I 
don't remember that; and as far back as I remember it was oil.  But never after Buvver and GG owned 
it. We didn't have coal. They had oil. We had coal on Wieuca Road for years. And we had it on Penn, 
and Daddy used to have to stoke it. Once, while Liza was working at Log Gables, the coal truck 
brought coal to dump- maybe you heard this story- and there was a chute. They put the coal down the 
chute into the basement, and then I couldn't tell you what the count was of loads of coal that came 
from different companies, and dumped it in the yard. Somebody had ordered all that coal and had it 
sent, and I am sure I know who it was.  I am sure it was a Garry Thornton that lived down the 
street from us, and we didn't like him and he didn't like us. I don't remember how it was disposed 
of , but it was a dirty, dirty trick.

Kermit told me something this past summer when we were up there that I had never heard before, and 
I believe he told you how Buvver had slipped into the septic drain field and couldn't get out. You 
see, she wouldn't tell us stuff like that. She knows that we really, and I particularly, get on her 
case. She was really careful what she told me. Daddy used to and still does I am sure have those 
white hydrangeas down there on the lawn around the pump, and Steve was a non-talker; he didn't say 
anything. He was very gregarious and friendly and so forth but he got his way without talking. So 
Steve went down there and picked Daddy's hydrangeas, and Daddy got on him and Steve said, "Dan did 
it", and that was his first sentence. And we were talking about when your daddy, mother and Mark 
came to visit us. They came to visit us twice and on
his first visit, Mark was just a year old, and he was very messy; he was very messy. He got a tube 
of toothpaste and wiped it all over Frank's pants. And then and I was tempted to say some of this 
at his rehearsal dinner, but he swallowed a penny while he was there; that that was his first 
investment, and he didn't get any interest off it. So your mother had to watch it until the penny 
showed up.

Mom had the thankless job of checking me for worms. They don't have those things anymore, those 
pinworms. I haven't heard from them in years. And in Miami, in Florida they had this thing called 
creeping eruption that Dan and Steve had. A a little worm got under your skin; it was from the 
animal feces, and it would travel. And so they would take something and freeze it; that was the 
treatment for it. At Paris Island, we lived on the base and the people before us had two beautiful 
cats named Caesar and Cicero; we never heard anything about 'em until they came to visit us. Well, 
Steve and Dan both got ringworm, and BAD. I don't who gave us this treatment, but we had their head 
shaved and put household cement all over the spots. It cured the ringworm. We really had a good 
time in Beaufort. We lived on the base for twenty months.
While we were there, your daddy took boot. We were living in the basement of the Anchorage, a big 
house right there on the Beaufort river. He would come by and eat with us. This was after he 
graduated from Chapel Hill. Then he went on into the reserves. That was during the Korean war, 
Harry Truman's police action, there were 55,000 deaths.

Did you not agree with it? No. Did you agree with Viet Nam? No. And I don't agree with Bosnia. I 
think it's time the people over there carry the battle. According to all I have heard and read, 
this Bosnian conflict has not been going on for days or weeks or months; but for centuries. And the 
military experts that have spoken on the situation talk about how unless you went in there with an 
all out war, because of the terrain and so forth, it's a no win situation. It's going to keep on 
repeating because neither side is going to give in. And then what I have heard about the European 
view of this is that they do not want the Muslims in Europe. And of course the French are having as 
bad time with this because they are migrating from Algeria into France and they are a different 
culture.  So I think we were over there in W.W.I, and we were over there in W.W.II; then in Asia in 
Korea and then again in Viet Nam, and if they had gone in there to win with either one of the 
situations -now I'm giving you my opinion-that would have been different. I
disagreed with Viet Nam, but I would never ever think about protesting the way some of them did.